Awakened Company With Catherine Bell Blossom Your Awesome Podcast

Awakened Company With Catherine Bell Blossom Your Awesome Podcast

On Episode #250 of the Blossom Your Awesome Podcast Catherine Bell, author of The Awakened Company, shares her journey and insights on conscious leadership and creating healthy organizational cultures. 

She emphasizes the importance of personal and organizational vision, finding purpose, and tapping into one's inner compass. Catherine also highlights the role of mindfulness in work and life, the impact of a growth mindset on thriving, and the spiritual aspect of consciousness and collective impact. She provides practical guidance for individuals struggling with work and offers information about The Awakened Company certification program and her upcoming books.

Takeaways

• Develop a personal and organizational vision to guide your actions and create alignment.
• Tap into your inner compass and find your purpose to live a wholehearted life.
• Practice mindfulness to enhance productivity, creativity, and overall well-being.
• Embrace a growth mindset and focus on solving challenges rather than solely pursuing goals.
• Recognize the interconnectedness of all beings and strive to create a positive impact on humanity and the planet.

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Chapters

00:00
Introduction and Background

03:18
Journey to The Awakened Company

08:14
Living a Wholehearted Life

11:07
The Importance of Personal and Organizational Vision

15:25
Finding Purpose and Tapping into Inner Compass

18:49
The Role of Mindfulness in Work and Life

22:17
The Impact of Growth Mindset on Thriving

25:23
Doing Less to Get More

28:24
The Spiritual Aspect of Consciousness and Collective Impact

31:16
Practical Guidance for Stuck and Struggling Individuals

33:05
The Awakened Company Certification Program

34:21
Upcoming Books and Embodying the Elements

38:50
Closing Message

Transcript

Sue (00:00.898)
Hi there. Today on the show, we have got Catherine Bell here. I am so honored and delighted to have you here. Welcome to the show.

Catherine Bell (00:09.112)
Thank you so much for having me, Sue. It's a delight to be with you, and thank you to everybody who's listening as well.

Sue (00:16.71)
Oh, I'm so delighted to have you here and get into the remarkable work you do. You are the author of the bestselling book, The Awakened Company. You are the founder of The Awakened Company. I just love what you do. You are out here helping people elevate their impact, conscious leadership skills. You're helping people lead with purpose. You offer transformative leadership training. It goes on and on. You're also a poet, by the way. I just love that.

So give us the backstory, and then we're gonna get into the specifics.

Catherine Bell (00:51.896)
Thank you so much Sue. And there's a long backstory and I think everybody has actual backstory. So I'd invite everyone to consider what is their actual backstory and then how does that inform them to live a full and wholehearted life coming from presence and from being. So I invite everyone to consider that as I walk through.

the journey that I've had. And, you know, there's two things that have really emerged for me recently that I'm taking a stand for, and that is the empowered feminine and also the interconnection of all of us. I so often believe that we think we're isolated and yet we're so interconnected. So how did I get to this place? And I have an upcoming book with Rhett Hudson on the enneagram of creativity.

So how did I get to this wild and wacky place that I am, where I am right now? I moved every two years growing up. And that was really, really challenging. Because every year I'd be looking for where are my friends, where are my friends, where do I belong, where do I belong? And I think in having moved every two years growing up, it taught me.

that I belong wherever I am. I belong to myself and I don't belong to myself. You know, it's that paradox. So growing up, I had in many ways the privilege of moving. So it did teach me to how do we build community? How do we create community when I was moving every two years? And then I went away to university and originally I started in sciences.

And for every parent who's listening right now, whose child chooses to go a different route than they originally intended in their degree, it's okay. I shifted to sociology. So graduated with a sociology degree, and then nobody was, and I'm like, where do I wanna live? Because I had many options having moved so many different places. And chose the province that I'm in, I'm Canadian, and chose the province that I'm in right now.

Catherine Bell (03:18.08)
because I thought the energy was good and basically convince people to hire me. I've always kind of had to convince people to hire me. It's a very interesting thing. So I'm looking forward. I now feel like I'm in a space in my life where things are more of a pull than a push, which is very, very refreshing. So convince somebody to hire me. And then I went into market research. I didn't really love it, Sue. So then I'm like, oh, okay, what do I do? And so I went to see a career counselor.

Sue (03:40.32)
Thank you.

Catherine Bell (03:47.74)
And this career counselor said, I think you'd be great at executive search. So did a ton of self-investigation at that point in my life. Went into executive search, again, 1995, nobody was hiring. So convince somebody to hire me. So if you're looking for a job, here's one of the tips I used to get the job was, I wrote five reasons why I thought I should be hired to this executive search firm and convinced them to hire me.

and became a partner with that person, did my MBA at Queens University, and then eventually that partner left for Spain. I joined one of the top 10 executive search firms in the world, amazing, amazing company. And I'm like, I could do this with a lot of creativity, a lot of verve, and different energies. So my former business partner, Nishihana, started another company called the Blue Era.

And the reason we call it blue era is cause when you look at the earth, it's mainly blue. So we thought the next, this was in 2008. We thought the whole next generation is gonna be about how do we care for our planet and the beings on our planet? So founded this executive search firm, did a number of things wrong, did a number of things radically differently. At the same time,

Sue (04:50.702)
Thanks.

Sue (05:12.846)
Thanks for watching!

Catherine Bell (05:13.864)
I was sitting in a dimly lit cafe in New York City at one point and the name Awaking Company just shot down into my being like a lightning bolt. And it was like, you're to write a book called The Awaking Company. And I turned to my colleague, Carolyn, I'm a Carolyn, I'm to write this book. She's like, Oh, yes, you are, you are to write this book. So I started the book. And the book was initially on executive search, how to hire.

Sue (05:38.009)
Thank you.

Catherine Bell (05:43.324)
I shared it with my former partners and they're like, this isn't very good. And then I was like, I really want Eckhart Tolle's publisher to publish this book because I thought that they really represented the consciousness of this time, Sue. So I...

Sue (05:52.126)
Thank you.

Catherine Bell (05:58.78)
was knocking on her door again this more push energy I'm ready for the pull this more push energy and initially she's like no people aren't ready to do this stuff in organizations yet this is too early I kept knocking I kept knocking I kept knocking I kept writing I kept writing I kept writing kept building Awaken Company and doing things radically differently like we were doing mindfulness in 2008 we were doing

yoga as a team in 2008. We were doing bring your dogs to work day. We were doing unlimited vacation during this time. So really Blue Era became like a Petri dish of how do we create healthy organizational culture? And it became a profit 200 organization, a best workplace and won a number of awards for the culture and tone that we were setting. And it really was this healthy, thriving community.

which I'm very happy to say continues to thrive today. The organization, eventually we brought in more partners and eventually we sold it and the organization that bought it left the culture alone. So it remains a healthy, thriving organization. So I'm writing the book, writing the book, writing the book and it's all on how do we create healthy organizational cultures.

Sue (07:06.699)
Thank you.

Catherine Bell (07:18.296)
And it was published in 2015 and then was re-released in 2023. Almost like it was too early when it was originally released in terms of the consciousness of people and organizations. Yet in 2023, when Namaste re-released it, people are ready for mindfulness. Yet we are doing it decades ago. So I've been playing with how do we weave practical research, wisdom traditions,

Catherine Bell (07:48.488)
and business research for decades. I teach at one of the top business universities. I consult to some of the largest organizations in the world. I also consult to small entrepreneurs who wanna create something amazing. And this is probably a decade overdue, Sue, when I finally am doing the Awaking Company certification that's starting this September. And I'm so excited to share it with people.

Now I also want to give you a perspective or vista on the whole person because I'm not just my work. I love to windsurf. I play tennis. I'm a yogi. I'm a mother. I'm a poet. And I believe that all of these facets of being, facets of ourselves, creates a whole so that we can really manifest wherever we are in a healthy way. Yet so often people leave parts of their whole at work.

And so my big thing is how do we bring humanity back into organizations to create healthy organizations that solve challenges that are either of planetary nature or of human nature. The next, I believe the next decade is really going to be about the collective and how do we work collectively and also the empowered feminine and the empowered feminine.

within us. And just so you know, I'm also on the board of an organization called Terra Mongola in Colorado. I am an advisor to the Science Center and I'm an advisor to the Impact Society which helps children, which helps youth. So, and everybody, when we think of

who and what we are. Ultimately, I think our lives are to be of service, to be of service for other people. So I'd invite all the listeners to think about how can we be of service to humanity during this very, very pivotal time? I think that I'm doing this whole series with Dr. Deborah Egerton on relationships and it's how do we create healthy relationships, relationships with ourselves, relationships with each other, relationships with the environment to serve.

Catherine Bell (10:02.816)
humanity and the planet during this very, very poignant and powerful time.

Sue (10:10.606)
Wow, that is so remarkable. I just commend you and it speaks volumes to your childhood, your upbringing, how you embody, like you say, maybe as a child it was difficult moving around, but you learned how to adjust and like you say, build community and see the world in this kind of bigger way, which is how you're helping bring people together now. So let me ask you, you know, it's

It's such a grand task, like what you're doing, but there's aspects to it really when we hone it in, where we start focusing on the more kind of the deeper aspects of ourselves, we're able to show up in this, you know, one consciousness way and bring everyone together. So give us your thoughts on that, like how you arrive.

to something, what is your guidance there for people? Because I find so often people are so kind of self-absorbed and so living in fear of competition and other people are giving people too much or too much information.

Catherine Bell (11:22.444)
Mmm, what a great question. I think competition is very, very healthy because it's really, we can only become better with the other. And I think we forget it's with the other.

It's not against the other, it's with the other. It's in shared space, it's in shared community. And I think everybody, you know, I'll often ask leaders, what's your personal aim? What's your personal vision? And sue, they have no idea what it is. And then I ask in organizations as well, what's your personal, what's your organizational vision? What's your organizational aim? And you know, I'll hear one thing from the CEO, another thing from the COO, another thing from,

the CFO. So there's not a congruency or alignment in terms of our aim. So if we don't have an aim, we will be led. We will be led by that fearful place that you speak of. Like I believe everybody needs to have a personal aim, an aim that's connected to our inner compass and also the external North Star.

I use something called the Enneagram to work with leaders on how do we create inner compass, nor star, so that we know what we're living in service to, that calls us to our higher place, our higher, more awakened place versus our asleep place. One of the reasons I think we're in the state we are is because of this perpetual doing, whereas our aim invites us into the being. How do we live in

internal alignment with our inner compass and our North Star. And I would invite every leader to have their own personal aim, their own personal vision, as well as ensure that the organizational vision is clear. And I wanna share, you know, I learned this the hard way. I learned this by making so many mistakes. So let me give an example on the corporate vision. So,

Catherine Bell (13:32.98)
We are sitting down at one of the organizations I led and I'm like, okay, team, here's our vision. Here's our vision, here's what we're gonna do. And all the team was nodding. So I took that as kind of a yes, they were affirmed and on we went onto our agenda. Then we brought in somebody from Denmark to work with our team. And because there was nobody in North America doing what we had done. And

Well, he asked the first question he asked, okay, what's your vision? And I thought, you know, oh, this is amazing. The team totally has this, they're gonna rock it. Well, nobody raised their hands. And I cried myself to sleep at night, that night. It was awful. As a leader, I'm like, I have totally flunked the beginning.

And so what did we do? We created a personal, an organizational vision together. And that made me realize something very, very important. And it's one of Margaret Wheatley's principles is people support what they create. So organizational leaders, invitation to create vision together. However, if you aren't anchored in your own personal aim, your own personal vision, that can be very, very challenging.

Catherine Bell (14:54.816)
your personal name, your inner compass, your North Star, and know what you are in service to.

Sue (15:01.978)
Mm-hmm. So give us some practical guidance, because I believe, as you do, and you do this for a living, that everyone has a calling or a purpose, but people struggle so much to find that purpose. Can you give us some practical guidance for those listening? Like, what's a good way to start kind of leaning into that?

Catherine Bell (15:25.656)
Great question. First thing is to understand. So first of all, the most successful leaders are those that are self-aware. So investigate some self-awareness tools. Do you know your Enneagram type? Do you know, can you look at the threads of your life and see where the common threads are? Where the common goal, gold is? So first thing I would do is actually have a leader do their Enneagram type, do their Enneagram instincts, know what those are.

then I'd have them actually do a journaling exercise to look over their own personal history for where the gold threads are, where they have felt most alive in their being, where they have lost track of all time. And when, because you know, there's Kairos and Kronos time. And when we're in the timeless time, those are the spots where I really have found that leaders we can hone in, in terms of what are

They're nuggets in terms of the external environment is giving us signals all the time. So are we actually paying attention to those to inform how we actually live our personal aim? So getting into doing some journaling, looking for those gold nuggets, those jewels in your lifetime and writing them down and seeing what the common threads are. And at the same time, it also suggests that knowing your values are very, very important too.

This is the aim. So this is separate from values. This is knowing where my inner compass is most like feeling fulfilled. So for example, for me, my personal aim, just to be very vulnerable is to really, to be a healthy universal muse, radiating love, wisdom and power in service to humanity and the planet.

So there's different segments of that. There's the radiating love, wisdom, and power. And power, I think, has been so maligned as how do we embody healthy power? And that's what I think the empowered feminine is inviting us into at this time. So that's kind of my internal, this universal muse. My external, where I'm in surface to, is the planet and humanity. So you can separate out the internal from your North Star. So the internal compass,

Catherine Bell (17:49.896)
is where you actually are on fire. So this is a personal thing. But there's one thing for it to be personal, but the next step is what are you in service to? The North Star guides us for where we are in the world. So how do we know what our North Star is? What are you in service to? It could be to, you know, create a colorful canvas of art or it doesn't matter, but we've got to know those two parts.

And what I find very interesting is a lot of people aren't as tapped into their inner worlds as they could be. And when we tap into our inner worlds, then it's easier to find the North Star in terms of what we are in service to.

Sue (18:37.142)
And so often it's these external distractions. So for you personally, do you have a mindfulness practice? What does that look like for you?

Catherine Bell (18:49.408)
Well, thank you so much. That's a great question. Yes, I have a mindfulness practice and I teach mindfulness and organization. So I practice meditation practice at least 30 minutes a day. And I'm also on this Buddhist path. So I have a sadhana that I'm practicing, which is a clarifying practice. And it is very, very powerful and there's lots of days. I don't wanna do it Sue. And I sit down.

and I do it because I know when I'm tapped into more of the vertical dimension, it helps with the horizontal dimension of doing. And in fact, I would actually say I am more creative, more productive as a result. However, it's stepping back into my own internal being that allows me to come out in the external world more fully. So mindfulness.

It's interesting because research on mindfulness shows that we will be more productive, more creative, more in tune, happier.

feeling more belonging, yet it's very counter to what our society rewards externally. So the invitation is for me is we know all this research on mindfulness. So how do we develop a practice? I have a regular practice in the morning and then the sudden I do whenever I can during the day, but I make sure it's done.

So the invitation is really to drop into the intoxicating, this is one of my quotes actually, drop into the raw reality of being, so that the raw reality of being becomes me. Dropping into this moment so that we can come and create from the moment and what the moment is asking for. And in that, I think we can solve some of the world's greatest challenges. When we do that, I believe in humanity is great.

Catherine Bell (20:54.12)
innovative and creative capacity when we drop in to that vertical dimension versus being on the treadmill of doing. I think in many ways the treadmill of doing has burnt our planet out and when you look at the data on mental health and wellness it's also burnt our people out, our humanity out. So invitation for everybody to

Sue (21:18.709)
Thank you.

Catherine Bell (21:22.152)
We have an app, Awakeningly, that has reminders of daily reminders of coming back to self, coming back to source, coming back to your own internal being.

Sue (21:36.274)
And you know what's so fascinating about mindfulness is this idea of detachment, which you're incorporating with your transformative work that you're helping. Because so often I find that leaders come with so much attachment, so much ego, so much agenda, right? So can you, if there's a commonality, like, what do you think is the one?

Catherine Bell (21:58.843)
Bye.

Sue (22:05.87)
create, if there were one that you've seen kind of time and time again, that keeps leaders and organizations from really thriving.

Catherine Bell (22:17.684)
Oh, without a doubt, without a single doubt, and this is based on Carol Dweck's research and it's proved true in my work in organizations is closed mindset versus growth mindset. So when there's the relentless pursuit of the goal at all costs and just to get a sticker to say you've done it versus using a mindset of growth and learning,

where the tree all of a sudden unfolds in maybe different directions than that end goal in and of itself. Having an open mindset is the key. An open being and growth mindset is the key to living a healthy life and also creating an organization that's more like a forest than a dead weight. Because when we close ourselves off that ego

When that ego is just call it, just, I'm gonna do basically what I'm scared of. I'm gonna keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it to get the end result. It doesn't create flow state. It closes off. It's like closing off the arteries to the heart, really. That's what it's like. It's like everything becomes constricted.

And so for example when leaders ask me, when CEOs ask me, can you take me from zero to a billion dollars like you did that other company? Wrong focus. If our focus is just solely on the end result versus on creating something that's gonna solve challenges that creates community, that's in service to our planet, you can see how you'd be focused on different things.

And what is more heart fuel? More heart fuel is focus on how can I solve challenges. Anytime you have a challenge, to everyone listening, anytime you see something that annoys you, that's an opportunity to start a business. Because that's the creation mindset. That's the how do we create differently. And I'm not saying it's gonna be easy, but it's gonna be fulfilling. It's gonna be very, very fulfilling.

Catherine Bell (24:38.64)
So what do you want to take? Do you want to take the easy path or the path that's asking to be walked that may take you up to the mountaintop down to see the lakes over sideways to see the deer that's waiting for you? I would say that pathway is more interesting than the one that is clearly laid out and you just act like a hamster on a wheel in automaticity. Invitation

Catherine Bell (25:09.668)
really come from this place of being so that everything you touch is healthy and joyful and full of life.

Sue (25:23.95)
Oh my God, that was so amazing and so powerful. All of what you just shared. I just absolutely loved that. So, you know, and it's interesting because it's so counterintuitive, right? Like everyone's working, working and doing, but it's almost this idea of like doing less to get more, but it's in that mindset. It's having that shift to see it and have this whole other perspective, like you say, that opens.

it all up to you.

Catherine Bell (25:56.032)
Very much so. And when we look at the data, I'm really big into business research because business research actually supports what we're talking about, Sue. Like what you and I are talking about is supported by the business research. So we know from Gallup, the majority of people are not engaged at work. We know from research, the majority of people rate the worst time of the day as their time with their bosses. So we have a whole bunch of boss holes walking around. And...

I feel badly for the leaders because they don't know and they don't know any better. Yet we know the most important relationship a person has at work is their relationship with their direct supervisor. And we know the majority of organizations don't survive. So in many ways, doing it the traditional way is a recipe of it not working.

And yet I'm big into what are the little tiny micro practices we can do every day because ultimately it's all the little micro things that we do that create a healthy forest. It's not like we have to do these big things. So in terms of engagement, one thing leaders can do is simply positively notice the other. Like simply say, you're doing a great job and here's why.

And it's all of these tiny little things on organizational culture. We know if we focus two thirds on creating healthy culture, one third on financial success, that's where alchemy exists. Yet how many leaders know that? Not many. So I'm big on how do we marry this business research into practical reality so that we can create healthy forests, healthy organizations for future generations.

I really care about the planet and humanity, and it's not rocket science. We can do this. And I think AI is also, somebody was talking to me about their concerns around the planet this weekend, and I said, you know, I think AI could really help us with this. So how do we positively also look at what's coming down the pipe? And it's our ingenuity and our creativity that's actually going to really solve the challenges that we're faced with.

Catherine Bell (28:15.14)
all through what are the tiny little things we can do and then letting serendipity take it from there.

Sue (28:24.098)
So now, there's an aspect to it that's very, I don't wanna say spiritual, but when we're talking about consciousness and the one consciousness and this whole collective way of showing up, it is kind of, we are tapping into something much bigger than ourselves really. So would you call it, is that an aspect of spirituality would you say?

Catherine Bell (28:52.096)
I think everything is spiritual and feel everything is spiritual and yet we've disconnected from spirituality. And I'm not speaking of it from a specific kind of organized religion sense. I believe that everybody has access to the divine or else how would we describe what love is? And I think we need to love our work and love what we're involved in and really care for the people.

we work with and care about our organizational missions. So yes, I don't think we've divided so much in our society that I think it's time we came back together and realized that when you do something, see what affects me. So you and your amazing podcast, all the ripples it sends out, it positively affects me. And let's say somebody were doing something to harm the planet or harm humanity, it affects us too.

We're all in this like spider, intricate spider web together. So when somebody pulls on one string, we're all affected. So the invitation with every leader is how to put positive energy into the spider web to create a healthier life for humanity. And you know, that sounds really big, but ultimately it's just like all the tiny little things we do every day.

to help another person and also to help ourselves. If we're not healthy ourselves, then that also sends a ripple out. So how do we serve from that perspective as well? And understanding the paradox of that, is serving ourselves, serving community, we need both. And I think the word and is not used enough. I am spiritual and I work in business. I am spiritual and.

I am a volunteer. I am a spiritual. I work and I'm a mother and I love to windsurf and I love to play tennis. Like that's not all separate. Yet we pretend it is. It's almost like we've been taught to be divided within ourselves and how do we bring back the wholeness? And the first one I would say is have a mindfulness practice as you suggested. Know your personal aim and know what makes for a healthy you.

Sue (31:16.162)
Oh, that's so beautiful. Now, if you had some practical guidance, just advice, let's say you're talking to a friend, somebody who's really stuck and struggling with work, or just in general, a boss, what would that practical advice be that you would give them?

Catherine Bell (31:24.248)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Catherine Bell (31:37.796)
My practical advice is focus on the micro moments. So what are the tiny little things you need to do every day? Write them down. Don't type them in the computer, but actually use your kinesthetic sense, your body sense to physically write them down as well. I would invite those people to come when we think about, you know, am I coming from my asleep place or my awake place? And to be the example.

that you would like to be. And also if you're not in a healthy working environment, to think about what are some of the things you could do in that environment to make it more healthy, and also to think about what it is that you most need and to take action steps towards that. So it's a combination. It's ultimately every strategy, strategy is action. However, can we act from the place of our knowledge,

and what our gut is telling us. We need to stop though to tap into our head, heart, and gut before we act.

Sue (32:47.318)
Now, okay, so a couple of things. First, I wanna know, so tell us, you're starting a certification program. So is that for other people to be certified in the methodology in your teaching so they can go do the same work essentially?

Catherine Bell (33:05.26)
That's exactly right. And so there's an application process for that. And so the application, you can find a waking company certification and then you can see where to apply there. And really it's to help leaders and coaches and facilitators facilitate this process to help solve planetary and human challenges at this time. I will be sharing everything I've learned as a serial entrepreneur, as a Profit 10.

organizational founder as a business school teacher in this program. So there'll be monthly sessions as well, there'll be ad hoc, I'm calling them office hours where people can drop in and ask me any questions. So they will walk away with a profound toolkit of how do I help organizations in this way. It's the first time I've done it, it's probably a decade overdue.

However, I finally feel like it's time and the community is ready for it. And to have people really go out and use it in their own work and it be empowered in their own organizations and also the organizations that they serve.

Sue (34:17.039)
I love that. And now did you say that you're working on another book?

Catherine Bell (34:21.336)
Oh my goodness Sue, I have three books in the works. So the first one is Enneagram and Creativity, and that's with Russ Hudson, who is an Enneagram thought leader. And it's how do we use the architecture of the Enneagram for more creativity in our lives. It's meant for artists, business leaders, so we're working on that and are in the process of signing a major deal with that book.

And I also have another book after that one on awake at work, which is the how to of Awaken Company. When you read the Awaken Company, it's about why do we need to create awakening organizations? And awake at work is about the how to create it. And then the third book, which is pure play for me, is a poetry book. And I think we've so kind of poetry now, I read at the start of business sessions.

Sue (35:11.635)
in school.

Catherine Bell (35:16.864)
because it taps us all into our feeling center in a way that very few things can. And so how do we bring those bits back? And that poetry book is based on the elements. So it's very provocative and fun. And in many ways, it kind of is the woman's dance because we don't have very many examples of wild bikinis and we're all involved. Women are so involved in multiple things

It really, I really kind of want to show that this wild bikini model can work. And I also want to show it because we haven't been showing it very many times. So, uh, I'm having a lot of fun creating that and I'm really looking forward to getting and having all these books published. And I also want to show that we can do all these things and still have a life. It is life.

Sue (36:10.858)
Oh my goodness, I love that. Well, I would love to have you back on for that, all of that. It sounds so amazing. Now, you know, and this idea of the elements, like that's just so again embodies all of what you do, like, you know, awakening to every element around us and everything that's trying to like guide us and teach us and lead us.

Catherine Bell (36:39.864)
Very much so. And so can we embody the elements in our being? Can we like water the emotions, earth, fire, air, space? And I invite people to contemplate the elements within them and what maybe is more needed to make them more whole. I have many kind of secrets I use when it comes to personal aims, Sue, that I don't know if the public is ready for yet.

But I use many different ways to get at how do we really embody wholeness, wholeness of elements, wholeness of goddess, god, you know? How? Anyway, so I love to play. The elements are very, very important.

Sue (37:32.406)
I love that and I would love to have that conversation with you. We can talk about that in a little bit. But so first and foremost, I just want to thank you so much. You've been so amazing and I think people are going to have so many takeaways from all of what you've shared here today. And just so honored to have had this time with you.

Catherine Bell (37:51.98)
Sue, thank you for your good questions. Also for wearing green today, because green is the heart chakra. So in looking at you and being with you, I'm reminded, I was reminded by you to be in my heart and to be in the moment. So thank you so much for your great questions and thank you also for your podcast. When I looked at the series of things you've done, it's awesome and it's in service to humanity.

So I just want to say thank you for the work you're doing and who you are and for also taking this time, which you'll never get back, will never get back with me. I truly, truly appreciate it.

Sue (38:30.818)
Wow, you're such a doll. Thank you so much. That means so much to me. And now in closing, if there were just one message, your hope for everybody, what is that closing message you'd like to leave us with?

Catherine Bell (38:50.864)
May everybody who is listening, and you Sue of course, have the experience of being with

and in wisdom, healthy power, and love. And I invite everybody to contemplate what those three words means to them.

Sue (39:24.17)
What a beautiful, powerful closing message. You've been so wonderful. Thank you so much. Thank you.

Catherine Bell (39:30.988)
Thank you, Sue. Thank you, everybody.